Due Diligence needed Urgently on SportsTechuk in merseyside

[TopCat]

hi
bit of due diligence needed here- recently bought an excellent Momo steering wheel from this chap in Liverpool on EBay

Now considering some wheels from same chap- thing is he wants to go outside of EBay- I will but only with signed contract/bill of sale combined with normal due diligence on person- ie copy of passport and copy utility bill to address etc

he doesn't want to play! Claiming that EBay will cost him around 10% of value!! Have asked him why not comply with Due diligence request.

I am unconvinced..........that what I seek is abnormal (you should see the normal AML CFT CDD processes that we are used to here certification etc!!) Pehaps I am asking too much. Thing is we are so used to dealing with transactions- if he were to do the dirty armed with the due dilly ie who is his and where within 2 weeks his feet wouldn't touch the ground!

Thoughts please? Anyone heard of him- is he here by some other name??
PS I have yet to have a bad experience through EBay - but there is always a first time!

[nas80]

Don't bother if he doesn't want to pay the 10% then he shouldn't be selling. I'd move on.

[TopCat]

have done so
suspicious of his grumpy replies!

[Mobster]

I know him very well. The hartge wheels you want to buy are decent. You will need one new centre. He is a good chap. You won't have any problems with him.

[nas80]

Not really a good chap if he is giving topcat grief?

Trust is earned not given.

[e21-Mark]

Just thought I would write a few lines about a spate of dodgy ads and sellers that seem to have cropped up lately. I know, that in an ideal world, we would all check things out thoroughly before we part with any cash but it's not always so straightforward is it?

Just before Christmas last year I saw an advert on Gumtree, for a pair of BMW 323i's. There was a description of both cars and details of their spec. It said that both cars had desirable LSD's and dogleg gearboxes and that the seller knew how valuable and sought after these parts were.

I rang the seller and asked for photos. I also asked him to confirm the specifications. He described the cars conditions and made it clear that he knew what the parts were and even said they were ''the first thing I checked when I bought the cars''. I told the seller that it was mainly these parts I wanted and that it was their value that justified the £2k asking price. In fact, I asked him several times, by phone and text, where he said he understood my needing to be certain but that I needn't worry. He knew I was 400 miles away and given his assurances, I trusted him and paid the agreed price.

Eventually the cars were delivered to me and it was obvious that, upon inspection, the cars did not have the parts described in the advert. I was obviously pi55ed off at being lied to and deliberately misled so obviously I rang him immediately.

Once the seller answered the phone he acted surprised that the cars didn't have the parts he'd advertised and described. He then started saying things like he ''thought they were there'' and how ''another guy had looked and told him that they were fitted''. The longer the conversation went on, the more times he contradicted himself. I made it clear that he had obtained my money by deception and that I wanted my money returned, once the cars were transported back. It was at this point that he stated this was a civil matter and it was clear he had known this conversation was coming. He also went on to make threats of what he would do, if I were to turn up at the address where the cars had been collected from. I also noted the guy had removed his Gumtree advert but I had already printed off copies and informed Gumtree. It's also funny how brave people can be when they're hundreds of miles away, sat behind their computer.

So, here we are a couple of weeks down the line and the matter is in the hands of the Police. I managed to trace the sellers home address via the DVLA, which came as a bit of a shock to him, so I just hope the Police decide to prosecute? If not, I'll pursue the civil case but I will see it through, whichever it is?

So, lesson learned and I won't trust anyone's word again. Sad but there you go. How many of us have seen things advertised though and taken them at their word?


It was then that last week another friend told me of some parts he had arranged to buy. He had received a call where the guy had told him he had some specific parts he was after. They agreed a price and the guy gave his bank details. In fact, it was his wife or girlfriends bank account. As I am sure you've guessed by now, that was the last he heard from him. He is now also being sought by the Police although, unless there is some written evidence, as there is with my own case, a criminal prosecution may be tough. ( offenders are Pete Firth & Laura Buckley - both from Hull and being sought by Police)

Then today I heard another case of someone advertising on a car forum. Another example of a desirable and valuable part that, with courier costs, totalled near £500! Said part turned out not to be what was advertised so it was promised that the money would be returned. Here we are 2 weeks later, no money and calls and texts are being ignored.

I guess car forums and the people that use them honestly can be seen as targets for those who want to scam money? The likes of Paul Woodward who have put an incredible amount of effort into joining forums with the sole intention of scamming people out of their hard earned cash. In the most part, the people I have met and dealt with have been decent, honest and genuine and I have always tried to be the same myself in return. It's a shame that there are people prepared to use that trust to their advantage.

I guess my motive in writing this post is stating the obvious? Yes, all of us who were scammed were too trusting and 20/20 hindsight is a wonderful thing. It does seem that the number of scams is on the increase lately. If you're on the hunt for that elusive part and someone contacts you, saying they have it for sale, just think twice before putting your hand in your pocket and if you do buy stuff, maybe those fees are worth the peace of mind, of knowing you have redress should things not be all they first seem.

[arshad76]

Interesting responses. To be honest TC I'd feel it a bit of a pain to show evidence of passports and so on, especially if someone contacted me initially for parts. If I know I could get a seller I'd either ask that person to use their trust at discretion or simply come pick it up in person.

I understand Mark's bad experience, but at the same time almost all transactions are completed on trust. One person using theirs to pay first or as has happened in the past with me, people sending me things through and trusting me to pay later.

Hard one in the end, except if you want that level of protection, I guess that's what ebay and paypal can offer - not necessarily a site like this. Not that it would put me off buying from this forum anyway.

[Mobster]

Couple of things really. Firstly, Nas, I agree trust is earned and therefore as the buyer has already had a successful transaction with the seller, one would imagine that A certain level of trust has developed. Secondly, as a seller I would not give any body my passport etc, if I was selling a house or car then may be, but a set of Hartge alloys, no way.
Thirdly, and probably the most important. You are parting with some hard earned cash. If you are not happy with the sellers terms of trade, then move on, it is really that simple. From the experiences you have described with the seller, why are you still searching for "due diligence". Best advise I can offer you is forget the wheels.

The wheels have been relisted so there is very little purpose of this whole conversation.

[TopCat]

the interesting thing here is that all along I offered to buy them through EBay as an alternative to any due diligence
which he refused

and now he relists them via EBay and PayPal- you can see the inconsistencies!

he also said that someone was coming to view them today but later told me that if bought they couldn't be retrieved for a few days as they were elsewhere.
I am sure he is an OK bloke if you know him Mobster- but I guess he didn't give off the right vibes
if he were someone on this forum then again I would have had more comfort

meant to thank everyone for their input- most helpful= the power of the internet!

[Jeroen]

Agree TC, it is weird that the seller wants to fly under the radar all the time and comes up with irrealistic explanations. That would ring my alarm bells as well. And as we say here in Holland, when in doubt, don't overtake!

[m3gaz]

I think we can get lured in by the rarity of the part.Patience is a virtue and if you just hang on,most of the time,someone in the E21 family will come up with that part you are after.I'd sooner pay one of you that little extra than to deal with some scum bag whose sole intention is to relieve you of your hard earned.These people are not stupid.They know what part or what price is going to get your attention.
I,for one,don't buy off of ebay.And gumtree,in my humble opinion,is full of crooks.
So my advice is.....use the wanted section on this forum more and keep it in the family.That way we,who are in the know,can sort of,dictate the prices of what we buy and sell amongst ourselves.Thats what is happening in the VW community.I've had some good little deals from people on Vw forums over the past few months.
But thats just my opinion.

[Mobster]

I can assure everyone that this seller is not dodgy, i know him very well. This transaction was merely a case of the buyer and seller not being able to agree on terms. If you still want the wheels, i can get him to agree on a paypal payment and therefore you are protected. Its up to you.

[TopCat]

thanks Mobster
Am off to south Africa in the morning for a stack of business meetings as well as a couple of race meetings(!) - as I have revealed here elsewhere................

will have a look at this if they are still for sale when I get back! as I have said it is not the end of the world for me if they do go to a good home................in the interim

With a PayPal payment will he agree at the very least to a full Bill of Sale as I may not be able to arrange collection quickly (I only ask this as the ebay listing is not clear as to how many wheels etc are involved- I had to ask!)? I appreciate the easiest way would be to meet him and the wheels (out of storage ) but this is not possible at the mo.



Glad to hear of your support (to his credibility)

[Mobster]

Yes, i am sure he will. With paypal, you have the assurance that if anything is wrong, 99.9% of the time, they side with the buyer. If they are still available when you are back, maybe you guys can sort something out, however, 4x100 Hartge wheels rarely come up for sale, so i dont fancy your chances. Ps. If they sell, i do have some 5x120's !

[Jeroen]

Hey TC are you back yet? We want your stories, photos, videos, race results, the lot!