"Sensible" Suspension Advice Please?

[e21Keith]

My e21 323i resto is gathering pace (slowly) and I'd like some advice on suspension.

I had an e21 320 back in the 80s, the suspension was a bit rolly polly and the handling wasn't that great. I've been driving e30s for years and the best suspension set-up is the 325 Sport or Touring in my opinion, because it doesn't look lowered and it's just a bit stiffer, ideally this is where I would like to get to, something sensible for daily driving.

I do NOT want coil overs, super hard suspension or a low rider (maybe a little reduction in ride height but not much)

I DO want something slightly stiffer a bit like an e30 325i Sport/Touring (which has only a 10mm drop in ride height).

I WILL most be likely running 13 inch wheels

Any sensible advice sought

[Jeroen]

Hmmm sensible huh

Thing is that in standard basic setup, E21 and E30 suspensions are miles apart from each other when it comes to handling. Even though the E21 was renowned for its handling in its day, compared to more modern standards it is plain soft and the 13" balloons only add more softness. Some of the most popular options are laid out in the Suspension topic in the FAQ section. I tried to make a sensible start there

However, what I did run into a few times already lately, is that there isn't a decent 'best of both worlds' like there is with the E30 Sportfahrwerk. Improve handling, take it to a level that is way beyond acceptable, but don't lower too much. In your case it will not easily be too hard since you will be on 13". It is about time for me to check with a local supplier and manufacturer as I had a similar discussion with several people lately. Will keep you posted on possible alternatives.

[arshad76]

Hi Keith, I can only talk about the set up on my car which had Ventura springs and Bilstein sport shocks. The ride was beautiful. Good around the twisties without being too hard over bumps and no noises or clattering.



I don't think Ventura are available new anymore so Eibach or H and R would probably be better alternatives.

[e21Keith]

I bought my first e21 in '86, it was a 4 year old that my dad bought new and I can tell you at the time the handling was widely regarded as poor, the (then) current stock Sierra 1.8 was way better through the corners! It was a car that you had respect that the back end was likely to go sideways with very little warning.

My 323 donor has non-stock springs, painted red, no idea who they are made by but the ride height doesn't look stupid so I may give them a go. Going to need new shocks anyway!

[Jeroen]

Interesting. Back then I did all my km's in E21's, E30's and Sierra's and the E30 was superior, by far, even a 316 on stock suspension. Sierra may have been more neutral... it had no grip whatsoever and most times understeer occurred before oversteer, perhaps that was more fool proof. I never found the oversteer of an E30 tricky, flooring the throttle of an E21 on old suspension and tyres in the rain, THAT was tricky lol.

[e21-Mark]

The problem with E21 handling wasn't a lack of grip, it was the slow, dimwitted steering. It was still way ahead of the Sierra though.

The advantage of coilovers is their adjustability. The springs are also cheap and easily changed, so the optimum set-up can easily be achieved. A viable alternative, for a daily driver, is the kit offered by Spax.

[LeeLee]

Gaz coilovers are amazing when it comes to upgrading the handling on mine the diffrence was unbelievable and they are so comfortable don't have to be low riding or super stiff infact cheap nasty coilovers do that,with adjustable dampers and you can request softer or harder springs from gaz and every bit of the suspension can be replaced

[nas80]

It's totally the steering that lets it all down. I blew about 1.5k on driveline improvements and it was the quick rack in the end that "fixed it"

If you want a good blend some b4 with some 40mm lowering springs are perfect. Esp if you can find some that are progressively wound.

[pandemonium001]

suppose it all come down to budget.
cheap, comfortable, sporty.... pick any two. there will always be a compromise one way or the other.
nearly new/ used ex Motorsport stuff can gain higher quality, at a reduced price, then mix'n'match to get it where you want it.

its all down to perspective as well, try and find similar cars with different setups and have a passenger ride with them.

I would recommend coil overs, just adjust the lb/in, height, spring length and damping to suit taking advise from the manufacturer.
have a look on balancemotorsport website.

what condition are the suspension bushes? agree with the steering as well, looking to sport up my E12 as well.

[e21Keith]

Interesting, I went from an e21 straight into a Sierra, neither car was modded but the Sierra was more sure footed, and believe me I always push the handling. As for the e30 I found it way better than the e21.

[Jeroen]

LOL my most anxious moments in life were during high speed driving with the Sierra. Really light curves that were no problem at all at 170 kph in the E21 316 almost got me killed in a brand new 1st gen Sierra at 140. And track laps in the E21 always were hard work, first time on the track in an E30 everyting fell into place and it felt like it took turns as a 2nd eh 1st nature. Funny how experiences can differ!

[pandemonium001]

You do also have to consider, age related wear, and other components that the car may need to bring back to factory fresh.

presuming your dampers are still serviceable i would do the following:
how old are the bushes?
what make/ quality are the tyres, do they all match?
how old are the tyres, recommend changing after 3 years.
suspension/wheel alignment??

my first port of call would be a full suspension bush overhaul, stiffness/ harshness grade is up to you. The cars are knocking on 35+ years old now.

get your end goal wheels and clad with the best rubber you can afford, my favorites are:

michelin pilot sport ps3, dunlop sport sp03 bmw start rated for the X3, continental sport contact.

then judge your suspension, and work from there.

all the little things add up to a much more stable predictable car if the wheels are held where they are supposed to be, and not getting unwanted camber and toe changes mid corner.

[Jeroen]

Hmmmm depends on the desired size if still available anyway but some of these tyres... PS3 are rubbish compared to PS2 and SportContacts are ok when new but detiorate pretty quickly, even their 5th generation. More differences in opinion perhaps lol

[TopCat]

I bought my B6 28 with Rock Hard KW coilovers with No suspension travel at all!

luckily vendor supplied me with the Alpina stuff which is far better after I sold the KW stuff and fitted same

Now in extremis the Alpina stuff is OK but not race ready- but as an overall compromise -(it is not a race car) it works OK- quite a bit of roll you can see here:

viewtopic.php?f=55&t=18241&start=60

Quite agree that the E30 is far easier to drive harder- although the steering lets the E30 down (being a RHD 325i sport set up)- I don't know if the LHD E21 Alpina steering is different from standard but it does feel much better than the RHD E30? Don't know if this is another LHD - RHD issue?

I would defo go for 15 wheels; you'll find much greater options in ride handling etc

and these days there are several half decent cheap 15 BBS lookalike wheels around

[Jeroen]

Don't think there are differences between handing LHD/RHD either with E21 or E30, but the E21 is more vague in steering than the E30, especially with P/S fitted. E30 M3 or E36 rack is a good upgrade for the E30, easier to source than a steering rack upgrade for the E21... unless you're on bmwe21.net of course